I IV V, Oh so close!

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I IV V, Oh so close!

Postby TC90 » Tue May 15, 2007 2:41 am

Very simpe, but it took me a long time to "see" this. If it helps just one child, it's worth it. :lol:

In a standard I IV V progression, the V7 chord is on the same fret as the I chord using the C7 shape, and the IV chord is just two frets back, assuming you are using the E shape for your I chord.

I see many guitarists go "up" to the A shape for the IV chord, and then on up two frets for the V, when the V7 is so close and simple to play (C7 shape).

FWIW,

Keep on Bluesin'! 8)

TC
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Postby FunkyStickman » Tue May 15, 2007 3:26 am

That's a good observation, TC90. There's more than one way to finger a chord! I think most guys play the V chord (B7) that way because that's the "rock" way to play it. A truly good guitarist will use different fingerings for the same chord in different situations. I play songs in E about 3 different ways, depending on the "feel" I want to give it (not that I'm truly good, but I learn a lot by listening).

Experiment with voicings and what we call in the saxophone world "Alternate Fingerings." Sometimes it's because it's easier to finger, sometimes it just sounds better!
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Postby maxx england » Tue May 15, 2007 9:28 am

Yup, changing what you do is useful. It's nice not to have to rush around the neck and also, you can change the feel of chords, since the relative intervals can be transposed relative to each other.

I know what I mean, even if it comes out awkward.
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Postby grumpygroo » Tue May 15, 2007 4:35 pm

Always important IMHO, to know the different inversions of a chord. Different inversion different voicing. Epsecially if you favour the more jazzy end of blues.
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Postby jeffl » Tue May 15, 2007 4:57 pm

grumpygroo wrote:Always important IMHO, to know the different inversions of a chord. Different inversion different voicing. Epsecially if you favour the more jazzy end of blues.
"Voicings"- in other words, the order in which you place the notes of the chord (from low pitch to highest)- change the emphasis of the chord, or the sound. They become very important in relationship to which notes the other musicians are playing at the same time ( since your note may either bury or complement theirs) as well as making it either easier or more difficult to transition to the next chord or notes in the phrase. Sometimes the voicing you want, in order to get the sound right, necessitates a fingering that can make it more difficult to transition to the next chord or phrase & that's a bummer.
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Postby Bournio » Fri May 18, 2007 7:46 pm

I think I get what you're saying but not really... i have trouble picking up what's being said I need to be shown... any chance of pictures?
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Postby TC90 » Thu May 24, 2007 12:06 am

Here's the best I can do for ya Bournio,


I A7 (root in Bold)

-----------5-------------------
--------------------8----------
--------------6----------------
-----------5-------------------
-----------------7-------------
-----------5-------------------



IV D7 (C7 shape slid up 2 frets, root in bold)

----------x--------------------
-------3-----------------------
---------------5---------------
----------4--------------------
---------------5---------------
---------x---------------------



V E7 (C7 shape slid up 4 frets, root in bold)

--------------x-----------------
----------5---------------------
-----------------7--------------
-------------6------------------
-----------------7--------------
---------------x----------------


Note how close the I7 and V7 chords are, same fret
and it's a breeze to slide from the IV7 up to the V7

How cool is that! And it's moveable anywhere you can reach! 8)
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Postby jaybee » Fri May 25, 2007 9:24 am

if you REALLY want close, try this:

I IV V
----------------------------------------------
----(5)---------(5)-------(7)--------------------------
----6-----------5---------7-----------------
----5-----------4---------6-----------------
----(4)---------(3)-------(5)--------------------------
----------------------------------------------

A7 D9 E9 (part of)

I use this a lot - mostly the 2-note variety - when playing jams where there is another guitar player banging out barred chords, just play some "fake horn stabs"
I never get tired and always get noticed... either because someone noticed what I was playing and liked it or because they saw me "hardly do anything, but what ARE you doing" OR "why don't you play some more, like the other guitar player did, now he had to do 'everything' ", now THAT's usually a guitar player asking 8) - standard answer is "if he's already doing 'everything', I might as well take it easy and just do the little things that make it music but he doesn't think of, no?" 8)
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Postby TC90 » Fri May 25, 2007 2:21 pm

Right on Jaybee. The two note variety is so simple it outta be a crime to use! :D

I use that quite a lot, and find that the two note variety makes it easy to throw little fills in here and there with your free fingers. Sliding into and out of those two note "horn stabs" is way cool too!

Any other tricks you have to offer, as this is one of the few I do know. :D

Keep on bluesin'! 8)
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Postby jaybee » Fri May 25, 2007 3:00 pm

TC90 wrote:Any other tricks you have to offer, as this is one of the few I do know. :D

Keep on bluesin'! 8)


play rests!!! whether you are comping or soloing, play rests! nothing gets boring so fast as someone who keeps spilling endless threads of notes without a resting point (remember that aunt who never stopped talking? well, some guitarists are just like that given half a chance...)

slide into chords from half tone lower or higher

TONE!!! make sure your guitar can be heard, NOT by putting it louder, but by using eq to put your guitar somewhere no one else is taking up space. this might mean that when you play your guitar with no other band members playing, you'll go "wtf is THAT", but when the band is playing your guitar isn't buried by bass/ keyboard/ horn... OR if you really want to have YOUR tone coming from the amp, buy a low watt amp that gets the job done and use that as YOUR monitor, stick a mic in front of it and let the PA do the job

that's what I do, I have a Dan Torres 18 watt Tweed Deluxe, a Laney LC15 (15 Watt) and an Epiphone Valve Junior head (5watt) - get my tone, use them as my personal monitor and the PA makes sure I get heard FOH. Added plus: I can get power tube saturation, try THAT with a 50 or more Watt tube amp without getting thrown out for playing too loud
:wink:
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Postby TC90 » Fri May 25, 2007 8:58 pm

That's exactly what I'm facing right now Jaybee. I have a 65 watt fender tube into a fender 4x10 wedge cabinet. I can't begin to push the amp, just way too much. I'd like to find a used Epi valve Jr. Do you think that would push the fender 4x10 cab OK and how what kind of controls do they have? Bass? Treble? Pre/Power amp gain? Would you suggest a different reasonably priced head that would do better?

Great tips on playing rests. I'm guilty of that, seems odd to have quiet at first, but if you listen to the greats, there's a lot of it. See my posting of Anson Funderburgh on You tube under Electric - great phrasing, space, etc. 8)

Thanks for all your input.
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Postby jaybee » Sat May 26, 2007 7:30 am

TC90 the Epiphone Valve Junior head has ONE control: Volume - it will push the 4x1O, even has choice of 4, 8 or 16 Ohm output

all the rest is done at the guitar... the Dan Torres doesn't have much more: bright volume, normal volume & ONE tone control.

The Laney has the works: gain, bass, mid, treble, presence & master volume AND a "bright" switch, so if you're looking for a lot of control this might ben the best choice, just disconnect the internal (10 inch) speaker and hook up your 4x10, that shouldn't be a problem
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Postby ricochet » Sat May 26, 2007 12:00 pm

One control's plenty. All these folks who talk about needing "power tube distortion" and wanting power soaks to keep volume down don't need that, either. They don't even need an on/off switch. Thing's got a plug, doesn't it?
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Postby leftyguitarman » Sat May 26, 2007 9:48 pm

I want to buy one of those Epiphone Valve Juniors. That way I can have an amp to carry around with me.
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Postby ricochet » Sun May 27, 2007 1:06 pm

If that's what you want, go for the combo. Remember that it works as a head too, just unplug the internal speaker if you want to plug in a cab.
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