Keys, d'uh!!!

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Keys, d'uh!!!

Postby david » Fri May 19, 2006 6:44 pm

I have posted the question several times, and gotten concise answers. I've done a fair bit of reading in theory books. But, the basic concept of what a "Key" is never sunk in. I just didn't get it.

I guess I'm dumber than a box of rocks with the intellectual agility of an old soap dish.

I got a "Mandolin Primer" book/CD for my daughter as she tries her hand at the new little monster. So, naturally, I've been working my way through it.

The book begins each chapter with a scale. The G Scale. The C Scale. Then proceeds to provide songs in the Key of G, or the Key of C.

It didn't explain anything, because who bothers to explain the obvious? But it FINALLY hit me: A song in the Key of G is using notes from the G scale.

FINALLY, I understand what all those folks were talking about when they said, "I don't know the song, but if you can tell me what Key it's in I can play along."

Now I feel like I've got to go back to the beginning and start all over again. I've never learned any scales, though I'm sure I've kind of been playing around with them all along.

I can only hope that Plato was right and when you discover how stupid you are, you just got smarter.
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Postby ricochet » Fri May 19, 2006 9:43 pm

Recognizing the obvious is a big step in the right direction. :lol:
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Postby allanlummox » Fri May 19, 2006 10:23 pm

"Now I feel like I've got to go back to the beginning and start all over again. "


That feeling is my favorite thing about music. Periodically, I have a realization that sends me back to square one - and makes me look at how everything ELSE I've learned fits together.

This is good for your brain.
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Postby nizer » Sat May 20, 2006 1:56 pm

Yeah that's a great feeling David when somethin that was a mystery is revealed before you. "Getting" the concept of key opens a whole new world of creativity and expression. And the cool thing with music is it just keeps happenin and yer always learning somethin new. Ever since I first heard it in the early 60s, I've always loved Ray Charles' version of "You Don't Know Me" off his New Sounds in Country and Western Music LP. Just the other day, I was playing my Harmony acoustic and the song just came out - all the changes including the diminished chords, the bridge, etc. and I had never read a tab and I don't read music or or nothin. I sat back amazed - rattling around somewhere inside me for 45 years and just pops out. Good thing I was playin guitar at the time :wink:
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Postby lorilu » Sat May 20, 2006 3:50 pm

That just happened to me with those drum rudiments that Mr. Allan Lummox brought up not too long ago. I was 'sticking' to the doubles, singles, and basic rudiments just to warm up, when I got inspired by Mr. Lummox's post about jazz drummers and knowledge of all the rudiments. I started messing with the drags, ratamacues and the like, and found that they totally applied to blues and swing as the Texas ruff and so on. WOW. I got the hang but would NOT have got there if I wouldn't have worked dilligently just on the singles, doubles and triples. I'm sorry, this is just like doing basic major scales on guitar and then moving on to include minor and diminished scales and so on. Very exciting. When the student is ready the teacher appears. Went back to working on some jazz too.
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Postby david » Sun May 21, 2006 5:41 pm

I've been tied up with the heavy spring farm work and haven't had a chance to devote to it, but I'm really looking forward now to going back and learning some scales.

(I bet everyone who has ever listened to any of my playing read my post, slapped their head and thought, "Now THAT explains a lot!)

I find that I'm even listening to music differently now. Amazing.
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Postby ricochet » Sun May 21, 2006 6:49 pm

Scales really help with improvisation! :D
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Re: Keys, d'uh!!!

Postby jellyroll baker » Sun May 21, 2006 10:16 pm

david wrote:I can only hope that Plato was right and when you discover how stupid you are, you just got smarter.


Sounds like you already knew how the keys and scales worked together, you just had to be reminded. Now, fetch me a slave boy and let's see if he can work oout how to double the area of a square...
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Postby david » Mon May 22, 2006 1:30 pm

Sounds like someone else is familiar with Friend Plato!

As he would have said, the structure of scales, octaves, keys, etc. wasn't invented, it was dis-covered. It's always been there as part of the Logos; we just have to re-member it--or real-alize it to ourselves.

Some of us are just deeper in the cave than others!

I bet Jung would have much to say about all this, as well.

Looking back on my late attempt to finally learn to make music, I think one of the reasons I was drawn to slide was that it allows you to be more fluid in finding the next note. Fretting means you either hit the note, or not. Sliding allows you to somewhat do a bit of searching and pause at a point where something seems to fit.

I've either gone the mechanical route of duplicating the patterns contained in song tabs, or just sort of moved the slide up and down the neck looking for something that seemed to be what comes next. That's pretty much what the three recordings posted on Soundclick and EZFolk do. To the extent that they "work" they must fit into the structure of what our culture re-cognizes as "music."

Now, if I can just figure out what it is that I actually did...

I've just GOT to find someone to play with, even if just an occassional jam. I think that's how you pick up the obvious stuff, not from reading books.

I mean, I can't figure out why I'm still not an accomplished guitarist; I've read several books on the subject!
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Postby ricochet » Mon May 22, 2006 5:17 pm

david wrote:Sounds like someone else is familiar with Friend Plato!
He's the guy who invented platitudes, isn't he?
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Postby 1dustyeod » Tue May 23, 2006 12:30 am

You mean Platotudes don't ya?

8)
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Postby bosco » Mon Jun 05, 2006 4:02 am

One of my favorite Tim Allen lines-

Wilson: Always remember what Ulysees said about Plato...

Allen: Oh Yeah, ya gotta keep the lid on tight or that stuff will dry out!
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Postby maxx england » Mon Jun 05, 2006 11:29 am

1dustyeod wrote:You mean Platotudes don't ya?

8)


I thought those were the funny looking things from Australia. No, not you Lightnin Boy.
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Postby ricochet » Mon Jun 05, 2006 3:24 pm

Heard this one this morning:

One of Socrates' friends came up excitedly to tell him something he'd just heard about one of his students. Socrates said "Wait! It must pass three tests. The first is the test of truth. Do you know for certain that what you're about to tell me is ture?" "No, I just heard it just now." "So, you don't know if it's true. The second test is: Is what you're about to tell me good?" "No, I don't think so." "So, you were wanting to tell me something that you don't know is true, and it's not good. The third test: Is it useful?" "No... No, I don't guess it really is." "So. It's something you don't know is true, it's not good, and it's not even useful. Why bother telling me at all?" "You're right... I gues I should mind my own business." Defeated, he walked away with his head hung low.

So Socrates was esteemed for his wisdom. And he never did hear that Plato was nailing his wife.
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