SONG FAMILIES

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SONG FAMILIES

Postby kiwiblues » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:02 pm

I know this is probably old hat to a lot of you, but I was just practicing up 'Little Red Rooster' when I realised it is almost exactly the same as 'Crossroads' and 'Feel like going home' :oops: :roll: '
I have known for a while that 'It hurts me to', 'Come into my kitchen','Sittin on top o'the world, and 'Worried life blues' are the same.
Would be interested to know from the experts here,what other groups of similar song families exist :?:
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby kiwiblues » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:52 pm

Well that was a bummer post.
Not a single reply yet!
Maybe I was just stating the obvious!
After all it's all blues ain't it?:roll:
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby spoonfull94 » Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:59 pm

Rollin' and Tumblin' family: Roll and Tumble Blues, Meet Me at the Bottom, If I had Possesion..., Minglewood Blues and many more. :wink:
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby stumblin » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:47 pm

spoonfull94 wrote:Rollin' and Tumblin' family: Roll and Tumble Blues, Meet Me at the Bottom, If I had Possesion..., Minglewood Blues and many more. :wink:

I was just about to say that!
I think the "Song Families" concept is a very useful aid when you're teaching Blues techniques. It opens up a whole bunch of songs for learners - by just showing them one or two songs and suggesting that they try varying it a little etc...
Well, it's worked for me.
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby kiwiblues » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:52 pm

I know two of those, but must confess I've never heard 'Meet me at the Bottom' or 'Minglewood Blues'? :oops: :roll:
spoonfull94 wrote:Rollin' and Tumblin' family: Roll and Tumble Blues, Meet Me at the Bottom, If I had Possesion..., Minglewood Blues and many more. :wink:
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby Django3 » Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:10 pm

Hi Y"All
Not a bummer post Brian[ kiwi] quite important! It is the same in Flamenco, phrases and the cutting and pasting of lyrics seems to be the norm.One can only draw the conclusion that the lyrics and phrases are not as important as the "deeper" meaning of the blues and its Spanish equivalent especially the cante Hondo laments.
Cheers jim.
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby OldWailer » Thu Jul 01, 2010 1:56 am

I have known for a while that 'It hurts me to', 'Come into my kitchen','Sittin on top o'the world, and 'Worried life blues' are the same.


Doesn't take rocket science to get "You got to move" in that family--but thanks--I wanted to learn 'Come into my kitchen' and it's good to know that it's a lot like some other stuff I know, I hadn't really thought about that. . .
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby ricbleu » Thu Jul 01, 2010 2:10 am

Didn't someone say that Vivaldi wrote 250 concerti.... every one the same. So yes, Kiwi, I believe there are certain "core" elements. Just a vocal inflection here and there is all it takes to give a song a whole different feel. Anyway, I IV V is enough for any man to have to commit to memory. And for those who like more of a challenge, it can always be done in F. :roll: :wink:
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby kiwiblues » Thu Jul 01, 2010 2:28 am

Or Bb standard tuning!
ricbleu wrote:Didn't someone say that Vivaldi wrote 250 concerti.... every one the same. So yes, Kiwi, I believe there are certain "core" elements. Just a vocal inflection here and there is all it takes to give a song a whole different feel. Anyway, I IV V is enough for any man to have to commit to memory. And for those who like more of a challenge, it can always be done in F. :roll: :wink:
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby spoonfull94 » Thu Jul 01, 2010 9:16 am

kiwiblues wrote:I know two of those, but must confess I've never heard 'Meet me at the Bottom' or 'Minglewood Blues'? :oops: :roll:
spoonfull94 wrote:Rollin' and Tumblin' family: Roll and Tumble Blues, Meet Me at the Bottom, If I had Possesion..., Minglewood Blues and many more. :wink:


:wink:
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby OldWailer » Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:28 pm

I read somewhere that Charlie Musselwhite (Blues harp player) said (I'm paraphrasing from memory here) "I only know one tune. Sometimes I play it fast, sometimes slow. Sometimes I play it in another key--but it's just the one tune. I was very fortunate to find a genre of music that would let me get away with that. . ."
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby kiwiblues » Thu Jul 01, 2010 8:50 pm

The songs within these groups are so similar though that in these days of individual ownership and litigation, the guys would not have been allowed to release those recordings.
If "Come into my kitchen" was a contemporary number there's no way It hurts me to would be allowed.
Just shows how backwards things have moved.
OldWailer wrote:I read somewhere that Charlie Musselwhite (Blues harp player) said (I'm paraphrasing from memory here) "I only know one tune. Sometimes I play it fast, sometimes slow. Sometimes I play it in another key--but it's just the one tune. I was very fortunate to find a genre of music that would let me get away with that. . ."
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby The Breeze » Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:21 am

There are tunes that share the same melody, many that share the same riff and timing, and even more share the reworked riff.
Listen to John Lee, many of his songs contain similar or reworked licks. His style is very localised. When you look at the wider styles that came about when people were able to travel more you will hear a lot of similar licks, borrowed, sometimes even with different words.
Listen to RJ's Travelling Riverside Blues, that lick has been modified and used in many songs, sometimes deliberate sometimes subconsciously, it might have even made an appearance in B'neck John's Your Time in the Sun.
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby blueshome » Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:05 pm

I can't believe that any versions of the Roll&Tumble theme were based on RJ's songs until after the 60's "revival". The archetypical recording by a guitarist was Hambone Willie Newbern whose version established the guitar part pretty much for ever. There were also quite a number of piano versions - go seek.

Come on in my kitchen, It Hurts me Too, You Got to Move, Depression Gone From Me, etc, etc, etc are all based on the theme of Mississippi Sheiks smash hit Sitting on Top of the World (9 bars btw).

For another tune based on the different 8-bar structure later to appear in Key to the Highway (ie going to the V in the 2nd bar) - start with Bo Weevil Jackson and work your way through ad infinitum.
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Re: SONG FAMILIES

Postby kiwiblues » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:48 pm

That's a good lead. What other songs are in this family?
blueshome wrote:I can't believe that any versions of the Roll&Tumble theme were based on RJ's songs until after the 60's "revival". The archetypical recording by a guitarist was Hambone Willie Newbern whose version established the guitar part pretty much for ever. There were also quite a number of piano versions - go seek.

Come on in my kitchen, It Hurts me Too, You Got to Move, Depression Gone From Me, etc, etc, etc are all based on the theme of Mississippi Sheiks smash hit Sitting on Top of the World (9 bars btw).

For another tune based on the different 8-bar structure later to appear in Key to the Highway (ie going to the V in the 2nd bar) - start with Bo Weevil Jackson and work your way through ad infinitum.
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