PACKIN' HEAT

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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby maxx england » Sat Jan 19, 2008 11:18 am

So let me be clear on this, the general ruling in most states is you can carry but it must not be loaded. Does this mean an automatic pistol must have the magazine separate from the body and the breech empty? Can the magazine be in place but not clipped? How near can it be to the gun without being illegal? And what is the fastest loading gun/magazine combination? This last would be of serious importance if the weapon is not going, as previously mentioned, to be an expensive and inadequate club.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby panhead74 » Sat Jan 19, 2008 12:12 pm

ricochet wrote:Won't see me breaking those laws. I've got too much to lose. They are quite serious about enforcing them if you do get caught, and you just never know what will happen. Go through the legal channels and do it right, and you won't get in trouble.


That piece of advice is every bit as important as anything that has been posted on this thread.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby ricochet » Sat Jan 19, 2008 4:27 pm

Actually, Maxx, in most states you can legally obtain a license to carry a loaded gun. Requirements vary, but it normally involves a background check, some sort of training class on the law with emphasis on situations in which you would or would not be justified to use a gun, some training in the use of firearms and some demonstration of a minimal level of proficiency. Many states have reciprocal agreements honoring each other's carry permits. If you're not licensed, the bottom line usually is that the gun has to not be readily available for use if you're carrying it in your car, but again requirements vary from state to state. Summaries of state gun laws can be found at: http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/ Googling "gun laws" will turn up other compendia, and each state's website generally has links where the laws can be read.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby jeffl » Sat Jan 19, 2008 5:07 pm

If a party host ever wants to show off his guns when I'm around, I leave. It amazes me that people will handle a gun after drinking alcohol. It's an absolute no-no. It's hard enough to be safe with 'em when you're entirely sober. When my oldest son got his gun safety certificate as a youth, I really had difficulty getting it through to him that guns were always "loaded". He'd be checkin' his weapon over and wave it right across your body, and one time after he was out huntin' squirrels he came back and propped his shotgun up in the corner of the stairwell, unloaded. I read him his rights on that one, 'cuz he had a younger brother with even younger friends, and the kids were constantly runnin' in and outa the house. I told him if I found it sittin' out again, it wuz gonna be mine permanently. I don't leave my home defense weapon loaded either...the gun still sits unlocked in my closet, but the ammo's in my dresser drawer. I don't even know if that's a good arrangement, but I've always had the attitude (even after I got the shotgun stolen) that if an intruder ever got into my house brandishing a weapon that I couldn't forgive myself if I didn't have a way of neutralizing the situation. Even though I'm a Christian, I don't think God's in the business of protecting all his little children from evil people; if he IS, then all these stories about good samaritans bein' shot or killed are misleading.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby grady » Sat Jan 19, 2008 11:48 pm

Way to go Bubba. You gotta be smart with a gun.
I agree with Rico about the law. I feel I've also got too much to lose to take any chances.

That's why I try to walk the line between "Legal & Illegal".
We have to protect ourselves in this World.

In my area, we have a VERY bad prescription drug problem.
These freakin' pillheads are running around robbing businesses, breaking into homes (even in the daytime !!)
and doing all kinds of crazy stuff.

I see it every day. That's why I wouldn't hesitate to shoot someone on my property.

One of my Neighbors was telling me the other day that about a week ago, she heard someone in her yard talking in the middle of the night.
She said she heard somebody say "Don't go up to that last house (talkin' about my house). That guy has Guns, Dogs and he don't give a shit. He'll kill you where you stand"

I don't know who it was but, he gave his Buddy some very wise advice.

Since that night, her Husband and their next door neighbor both went out and got carry permits for their guns.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby maxx england » Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:36 am

OK, so what's the fastest loading handgun from a standstill to "useability"?
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby grady » Mon Jan 21, 2008 2:37 pm

One with a Magazine(clip).
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby 601blues » Mon Jan 21, 2008 3:53 pm

Has anyone on this site ever had to Kill someone??how many have?? I have and never do I want to again,and still have to shake off the mems of that,was I justified? yes was I right?yes but it still don't make it better, we live in a very violent world, and most of it is due to what we teach our children and ourselves, Violent video games,movies that make killing seem the way for resolution, etc. However a permit or Lic. to carry a firearm does not protect you from long term issues,or legal woes.Just cause you have a permit will not keep you from prison.
Example....Keith and Nancy and little Keith 4yrs old,in 1981, Keith worked about 2 blocks away at a boat repair,Nancy would come and bring lunch everyday, one day she din't come,so Keith went to check on her,found the door to their old house shut no TV or Radio Keith felt something was up,He quietly opened the frount door to find his 4 yr old tied up and gaged and bleeding,He heard a noise in back, got his legal gun he had hiddin in the frount room and went to find Nancy, in the bedroom found A man raping Nancy she was tied up, Keith shot and killed him right there, and heard a 2nd man run out the back door,and down the side of the house, Keith ran out the frount door and killed him coming round the house,They charged Keith with 2nd degree murder for killing the 2nd man,cause he was running away, they reduced charges to manslaughter and Keith was sent to angola for 10 years, 2years later Nancy took her own life ,she blamed herself, little keith has permenate brain damage,And Keith got out and is trying to make a life, If keith had let the other guy go he would have avoided that, I would have killed em both too, but the point is once you pull that trigger is written in stone can't change it, better be sure of what your doing it ain't the movies!!
EXample...How will the law view it???? 1995 a Karate instructor kiddnapped a 13 yr from NO and went to california, was caught,and returned to New Orleans via plane, the father found out when and where they were bring him and waited at the airport by a pay phone and killed the kidnapper as the police walked by with him, NO charges were brought against the father!!go figure!!to me that would be murder he had time to think unlike Keith, he planned that, Not a sudden thing Like Keith, so don't think a permit or lic.gives you the right to kill anyone or will protect you when you do, Try calling the police let them deal with it!!you have a cell, if possiable call 911, cause if you do have to use that weapon thats the first thing they will ask you,Why did you not call the police????
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby ricochet » Mon Jan 21, 2008 4:17 pm

You're exactly right, 601. That's a tragedy.

And I'd be absolutely sick if I had to kill somebody. Doesn't mean I wouldn't if I had to, though.

And while I'm no censorship proponent, I agree that the movies, video games, TV shows etc. bear a great deal of responsibility for the violence of society today.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby 601blues » Mon Jan 21, 2008 4:37 pm

I would if I had too as well, however I felt the thread was saying permit or lic was what you needed, Its not, you need a cool head,and common sense ,and know when to just back away,wheather you shoot or just kick sombodys azz you wil have to justifi your use of force,what ever that may be, I know there may never be time to call for help,but if you call the police 911 and try to defuse the situation that will go a long way if deadly force has to be used, Just like with Keith, the big question was ,when you opened that door and seen you son on the floor Why did you not call the police then!! Who knows they may have been there by the time the 2nd guy ran around the house,!! Also you better be able to show that deadly force was needed ie. the other guy has a gun,or knife, Iam not talking if he is in your house, Iam talking about the permit to carry issue out side your house, If not you better have obvious injuries yourself, you will in most states have a hearing before the grand jury to face charges, even police officers go thru all that,the grand jury will rule for justified homoside,
Now in your house, if you know the person its worse you have to prove he intruded and was not invited, Its better of course if it is no one connected to you or family in any way!! The only point I was trying to make, Its a hell of a lot of crap no matter what!! I don't take my guns off my property!!
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby grady » Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:45 pm

Children have to have the ability to distinguish between what is real and what isn't.
My Son (who will be 5 years old in March) plays a lot of Video games that have violence in them.
He's playing Gothic (a Medevial RPG) right now.
Even at his age he knows the difference between "make Believe" and reality.
He's a very caring and thoughtful little guy.

Violence in Movies & games is a cop-out that parents who don't spend enough time with their kids
use as an excuse to defend their shitty parenting.
A lot of parents don't care what their kids are doing
as long as they're not bothering them. They buy them Video Games, a Computer and put a TV set in their
kid's Bedroom with all the premium channels never bothering to monitor what they watch or even talk to
their kids about it. They don't care what their kids are doing as long as they're not bothering them.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby grady » Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:51 pm

601blues wrote: 1995 a Karate instructor kiddnapped a 13 yr from NO and went to california, was caught,and returned to New Orleans via plane, the father found out when and where they were bring him and waited at the airport by a pay phone and killed the kidnapper as the police walked by with him, NO charges were brought against the father!!go figure!!to me that would be murder he had time to think unlike Keith, he planned that, Not a sudden thing Like Keith, so don't think a permit or lic.gives you the right to kill anyone or will protect you when you do, Try calling the police let them deal with it!!you have a cell, if possiable call 911, cause if you do have to use that weapon thats the first thing they will ask you,Why did you not call the police????


Actually, charges were brought against the Father who shot the Kidnapper.
His name was Gary Bochet. He pleaded "no contest" to Manslaughter charges and was given 5 years probation.

You can see the video of Bochet killing Doucet at the airport here,

http://spikedhumor.com/articles/38182/F ... venge.html
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby badfinger » Tue Jan 22, 2008 10:33 am

Let me see, now....

A quick scan of these 4 pages shows that,
- a lot of people seem to own a gun or guns intended solely for shooting people,
- they are not penis substitutes,
- few, if any, seem to have a real and justifiable need to be able to kill or maim someone at will,
- few, if any, have experienced an event where having the means to kill was essential to survival,
- in many cases the weapons seem to be accessible to children,
- most times that the guns were used, it was by children playing with them or otherwise stealing them...

I'm glad I live where I do.

On the point of children (of any age) having access to these things, when I had guns (shotguns and hunting rifles) they were kept in a locked, steel gun cabinet. Ammunition was similarly secured in a place separate and apart from the weapons. These accommodations were subject to inspection, both regular and impromptu, by the police.
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby maxx england » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:16 pm

ricochet wrote: And while I'm no censorship proponent, I agree that the movies, video games, TV shows etc. bear a great deal of responsibility for the violence of society today.


Nobody has ever explained to me, in a way that makes sense, why you can see free to air graphic displays of violence but not the "amatory" arts. I mean, which is worse, some so called hero creating a bloodbath on his way to victory without any legal hindrance, or 5 people all in love at the same time?
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Re: PACKIN' HEAT

Postby bigdaddy » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:55 pm

In the story about Keith killing the second man, if I were on the jury I would not of convicted him of any thing. I grew up in violent neighborhoods and I learned early that you don't mess with a person's mind. If I did something to freak them out enough to lose their minds and harm or kill me then it's my fault. On the other hand I have been pushed by people where I lost my mind, fear for my life, and I beat people real bad, until they stopped moving. When I was in eight grade, on two occasions, I had big ninth graders picking on me, I stabbed both of them and was sent to the principles office and told not to do it again. I walked on both accounts. That doesn't happen today, that was back in 1971. With freedom comes responsibilty but the movie and entertainment industry does not believe this. They put out their violent, bloody crap and when a person acts it out for real they scream "it's not our fault, the person was crazy in the first place." I disagree. These people acting this crap out are usally young people. I get angry about this matter. Violence is not a game, it is a real problem in todays times. Sunday night some punks drove by and shot up the house across the street from mine. Hit it eight times. That is the most coward act I know. I do live in Utah but drive bys go on a lot and innocent people are mamed. Why can't people live in peace and respect each others life? That's a naive question, I know and I also know the answer. It isn't going away. Yesterday I bought my estranged wife a gun and I'm paying for her class and permit also. In Utah we have an open carry law, any one who can legally own a gun can legally carry a loaded gun on their person as long as it can be seen. Some concealed carriers are starting to wear their guns out in the open. I will also. I believe if there are guns showing on a lot of hips then people will think twice about robbing or just shooting people as they go shopping. There are pro's and con's about open carry and I would not suggest my estrange wife do it. Guns can be taken away from weaker people and used. I really wish America would arm itself. Criminals and punks are. Go into an Impact Guns store. All of the sales people are carrying open guns on their hips. I feel safer there than any where. Ain't no body going to rob or shoot up that place, to many guns out in the open, loaded and ready for use.
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